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I am terrified for the survival of this game, and I shouldn't be.

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#121 Cantatus

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 09:33 PM

This is incredibly upsetting. I can only hope that they've got incorrect information - or are misinterpreting.


WildStar is an amazing game. Its inability to find a footing continues to baffle me...


I think one of the unfortunate side effects of digital content and fast internet speeds is people now have so many choices readily available that, if you don't grab them in the first 15 minutes, you lose them completely.  Nowadays, picking a new game to play is about as easy as flipping the channel on the television.  Don't like what you're playing?  Just head over to Steam and get something else or find a different F2P MMO to download and try.  I think people have become so accustomed to that that they have less patience than they used to.


And sadly, Wildstar blew one of its biggest chances at growing the audience by releasing the F2P update before it was fully tested and ready.  There are likely a lot of players that would still be playing the game but decided to go elsewhere when they either couldn't get in the game or got in the game and faced unplayable lag.


If the Steam release is still on the docket, hopefully they take that lesson to heart.  With the Chinese launch now off the table, that's truly their last chance at exposing the game to a new audience.  Wildstar can't afford another bungled release.  That, I feel, would be devastating to Wildstar in a way it wouldn't be able to bounce back from.

#122 Naunet

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 09:43 PM

I've been following this game since 2011, so I guess I just don't understand folk who picked it up and dropped it - or blew it off entirely. It's always been the best game on the market to me, even with its shortcomings.

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#123 Astranemos

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Posted 11 March 2016 - 11:36 PM

I really am going to miss WS.

Although I don't log in anymore,I still had some hope for it.

Maybe if Carbine didn't completely ignore everything that happened in the

MMO genre since 2004,the game would be able to retain a survivable number

of players.

What a motherfreakingcupcaking shame.

This is in my top 5 list of themepark games,definitely.

But I kinda get it.

Long(understatement) queue times.

A monolithic questing system(I like it but most people don't anymore).

Even Blizzard has advanced the concept,and in the latest versions of

WoW they made questing a lot less time consuming and a lot more fluid.

Very little focus on public events type of content.

A terrible open world PvP format.Who copys WoW for the PvP ffs?

Battlegrounds infested by bots for months,which resulted in even less

players queueing.

A F2P release that was one of the same in terms of the technical problems.

Almost no replay value for leveling zones.

Very alt unfriendly.


I wonder how many games have to tank before they get it.

People that play WoW,won't leave WoW for another game that is like WoW.

WoW works for a number of reasons,but the truth is that if it didn't exist,

and Blizzard released it today,it would botch and tank and fail hard.

It's like the 911.

People love it.Do you see anyone else trying to build a rear engined car?

No.Same with WoW.

(Dear devs)Stop copying that !@$%!@$%!@@!%$!2 of a game(which I'll end up playing

again in the end,but that's another story).


From the few reports we have for the new zone,it seems they are going with a more modern

approach,more open world and public oriented.

That's how all of the leveling zones should be from day 1.

That's how you keep new players.

Have your Raids and your Dungeons,but also offer the more social casual stuff so that you can

make some money.

Hell,even GW2 has Raids now!(IronyOmeter at 110,987%) .

This is not cupcaking fair,Wildstar.

Edited by Astranemos, 11 March 2016 - 11:42 PM.

One day I'll think of something very important and enlightening to put here.

Untill then...PewPewPewPewBrrzzzzfffffsssszzzPewPewPew.

#124 Olivar

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 12:26 AM

You know what pisses me off the most? That you have this pr disaster posting on the forum from Ncsoft and they don't even have the balls to take the lashback.

No, even on twitter they continue the pr bullshit bingo.
Yes Omeed this is about you.
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#125 synaesthetic

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 01:39 AM

I've been following this game since 2011, so I guess I just don't understand folk who picked it up and dropped it - or blew it off entirely. It's always been the best game on the market to me, even with its shortcomings.


because the modern mmo market wants shiny convenience at the swipe of a credit card and iwin buttons covered in glitter and cry and whine every time anything is even a little bit hard, which explains why the *cupcake*FFXIV keeps making money.

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#126 CheetosMascot TM

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 02:43 AM

Yes Omeed this is about you.

Shouldn't get mad at the messenger. The official post was mostly from the company. The real crimes as always are the mismanagement of this game. Hard to get distracted of that by some guy who is just relaying information.

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#127 Charge

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 02:54 AM

Well the message being passed out should not be utter BS either.......reducing staff because cancelling the China release, do me a favour.  They couldn't cope with EU and US with the staff level anyway so that's just got a dirty smell coming right off it straight away.  I'm not jabbing at the messenger either, the useless inept management that has led a potentially great game down the pan.

Edited by Charge, 12 March 2016 - 02:55 AM.


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Posted 12 March 2016 - 04:33 AM

They still have too many ppl for single game that is developed at current speed - that is the fact.


They have made this game failing all by themselves. 

First of all you can not have a game without casual content. Currently only thing worth doing are raids. Over drops 3-5 they were slowly introducing content less raid oriented, that was actually worth participating and they have simply destroyed most of that work with D6. And even hardcore players spend different amount of time in game and sometimes they do want just chill, doing stuff out of raid, as long as it have any sense. Currently 80% of players logs-in 15min before raid and logs out 15min after raid, most of the rest do PvP.


Another issue is how long it takes for new player to actually start playing the game.

LvLing takes still too long. If you know where exactly to go, know the game enough to kill things efficiently, there is ExP event and you will use boosts from cash shop, lvling will take you anywhere between 5-8h, but a lot of that time you will spend in 5-20/25 area, it gives wrong impression how long lvling will take and without all of above it will take ~40-50h (~25h if you are more hardcore player), for most ppl it will take whole month to reach lvl 50, especially that lvling in WS is not engaging at all especially after lowering difficulty lvl.

After you reach lvl 50, you are useless. Unlocking character was good only when all started the exact same time and when only way to unlock it was by using EGs (so before original release). Currently it takes additional 40-50h of gameplay to fully unlock your char and that ONLY if you will go PvP and ONLY if you know what to do.

Gearing up new character is terrible you need over 90k prestige to buy full PvP gear and that is after you unlock your character first (well you should buy gear without imbuements first). So for average player it will take 2.5-3m to have lvl50 fully unlocked and geared PvP character. It is a bit easier in PvE, but there you need super expensive runes, as an old player I haven't ever realised how annoying it might be. On top of that in PvE there is major gear gap, you start with blue ilvl65 PvP gear (well if you know game white i50 items are enough for gold dungs), after that you need premade i65 group to learn anything on dungs and to get i80 items - that will not happen in 1.5y old game, so you can farm WBs, where droprate for items is just too low or.... Either be pushed once in GA or every day in dungs, alternatively farm gold in PvP for crafted gear - neither of that will help you learning game.

To start playing WS as normal player, that can spend few in-game hours few days a week you need at least 1.5m, most case scenario it will take ~3m. After that you need at least 2d/week that you can play for 3-3.5h straight and another 4-6h to farm gold for runes for your gear (can be even in 20-30 min sessions), this is fine, but close to nobody will invest 1.5 month to even start playing.


Another Carbine sin is release, actually both of them. They have lost a lot of players on original release, because of queues that led to making tons of servers, that were empty after short period of time. That I somehow can understand, but on what happened with F2P lunch there is no excuse. You know (or should know) what will happen with influx of players (there were data from original release) and you should prepare for that, even if you have failed - 2-3 weeks to fix problem??? This failure was responsible alone of loosing at least 90% of new F2P users, over 90% of come backs and even some players that against all odds were playing this game all the time since original release.


On top of that "Carbine knows better". Carbine fails to acknowledge and fix problems, that their community presents to them. Good example are arenas and PvP in general. Initial arena problem was balance, mostly because of gear gap, broken class combos and broken items with OP specials. What Carbine did was fixing issue for over half year, meanwhile most ppl that were playing only BGs stopped playing, because you couldn't compete in 1.5k BG gear with 1.8k arena gear, arenas queues became so deserted that nobody wanted to play them any more (it can not be funny playing same team every day for Xh, for few weeks). So obviously after they fixed gear, they have great idea to make 3v3 rated only way to play PvP - that would be fine, but ppl were mostly queuing solo for 2v2 before and it is always easier to find 4 players, than 6. That wasn't even that bad, the problem is Carbine was and is trying so much to make arenas more populated, that it ends with ppl not queuing BGs. Obviously a huge problem with BGs were bots, it took "only" 2m to get rid of them (I am surprised any1 was queuing BGs at that point), but currently to complete weekly quest for costume token (only reason to even play BGs - contract rewards are not attractive, prestige is useless, gold is useless, there are no player ranking, nor rewards on the end of season) you need 40 wins, so in theory 80 games, so at least 800mins/week, nobody will invest that time, if same you can have win trading arenas for 2-3h. Ths is only example, but it works exactly that in many arenas of the game.


Finally the whole F2P transition.

You CAN NOT have F2P game without cash shop....

Even now half year later there is nothing decent to buy there. This game have so much potential with CS and literally nothing have been done.

There were single claim mounts at price of account wide unlock in most of other games and most of them are just reskin of same model.... Now we finally have account wide months, but they are extremely overpriced.

Costumes.... if I could mix up pieces from different costumes I will maybe create 3 decent ones and one of the would be differently coloured medic costume from GA. I recently logged in to see GW2, I would buy ~80% of costumes there, in WS my count is 0.

Housing - probably biggest failure. Remodels on ground and sky are fine, but there should be 10x more of them. Not to mention we don't have any music remodel, we don't have house skins etc. But decors are disaster. Nobody will buy single decor for 1 euro, if sometimes you need dozens of them to create one object on housing plot. How it should look like? Currently most (if not all) decors for house plot are object you can find in your journey across nexus, if you will start looking soon you will realise many of them are just not available (as dominion I can easily find 5+ standing by the contracts board). Fist of all every single object in game should be in CS as decor. Second most decors should be sell as account bound housing plot vendor unlocks in themes of 50 decors in each theme for 800-1600 NCoins. In each of those should be 1-3 expensive (3-5plat) decors to boos carbine profits from CREDDs. Every single theme should have at least 2 equivalents with different decors (ex. Dominion1 Decor Pact, Dominion2 Decor Pact, Dominion3 Decor Pact), there should be theme for every major fraction/race in-game + some general (electronics, trees/plants etc.).

Knowing how many players are into housing in WS, how many of them are spending a lot of time there, how many of them are creating thematic houseplots and replacing all decors from time to time, housing could alone create enough cash flow to make WS one of the most profitable MMOs out there. And let's face it, all decors are already there, so saying it would be cheap and rather easy to implement is a fair statement. Instead we had F2P transition without CS. I have no idea how carbine wanted to make $ out of the game, same as I have no idea how they have make more after F2P, than in last quarter of P2P. 

#129 Dahl

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 05:44 AM

IMO, the biggest mistake Carbine did was not being honest when shit hit the fan.


Look at FFXIV. A giant mess at the start too, but Squenix did the right thing and admitted their mistake, went back to the drawing board and made something much better.

And guess what? FFXIV is now a success.


Being honest with your players, especially when things are crap, is the most important thing to retain players.

But yeah. Carbine went with the corporate bullshit instead and look where it got them.

#130 Ramjam

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 08:38 PM

Wow! I should not have checked the forums today
How i ever decided to pay up through October 2017 is making me feel a bit sick now

#131 Nazryn

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Posted 12 March 2016 - 10:33 PM



I'm sorry I had to do it.  :lol:


I like the positive spin you're giving on this Nazryn. Kudos. I'd love to buy into the idea but I remain doubtful myself. Here's to hoping you turn out to be right.



I'm genuinely not spinning it. It's obviously upsetting for all of us, and we've lost some really great devs. But from a business standpoint it makes a lot of sense. Wildstars revenue has been *improving* since F2P substantially. It's not WoW or Lineage levels, but its been going up at least. If the problem really is like it's announced, then my semi-educated guess would be that Carbine was notified that if the Chinese BETA didn't go well, or seem viable, they would be facing cuts like this. And that makes sense; with the numbers its already pulling, W* should be profitable as long as overhead is kept to a minimum (aka, less staff). If the article I posted a day ago is accurate; then Carbine's still got around 100 folks working the game, which is not a dead end scenario.


There are few reasons to not shelf the whole game at once rather than lay off folks as has been done. One potential is they wan't to milk the the next drop and then kill the game after that. This doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me; as they know how drops tend to do financially. If the games not profitable they SHOULD have cut their losses entirely already, and instead of cuts, Carbine should have just been closed to cut losses. 


This leads me to think that they just culled the staff to instantly reduce overhead; the remaining team will be kept on IF drop 7 brings in a certain threshold financially; if not then the staff will be further cut to a real skeleton crew and the game will run on maintenance mode until it costs out weigh expenses, which at that point wouldn't likely be for a while.




This is incredibly upsetting. I can only hope that they've got incorrect information - or are misinterpreting.


WildStar is an amazing game. Its inability to find a footing continues to baffle me...


I wouldn't in a million years take Polygon at it's writers word. What they likely did was have a source who mentioned a situation similar to what I mentioned above (first round of cuts to slash overhead, then PENDING success of Drop 7, more cuts if financials don't meet a certain level to leave a skeleton crew working on game maintenance). 


Anyway, if you cry wolf and say all is lost for ANY game, eventually you'll be right. When the game goes it goes, but we've survived layoffs before and this instance is likely no exception. And if things don't swing up for the game, I'm sure this community will push hard to get a private server up after it actually ends. No point killing the game in our heads until it's actually dead for REAL ;)

Edited by Nazryn, 12 March 2016 - 10:35 PM.

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#132 SoulEquilibrium

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Posted 13 March 2016 - 07:44 AM

Oh pardon I didn't mean "spinning" as in twisting the truth. I simply meant you looking at it from a positive angle. It was meant as a compliment.

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#133 ChemBoy613

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Posted 13 March 2016 - 10:45 PM

Why can't there be more


players doing more


content and 




Oh wait... why do all that!


You have BIS costume and gear by going to BnS and swiping credit card!  You'll look amazing and YOU WILL MAKE TRIVIAL CONTENT MORE TRIVIAL :s


but yeah... I mean, would you rather be able to spend a couple hundred dollars for your gear or EARN your gear?  Shouldn't your accomplisments mean you DID something, not BOUGHT something?


or maybe i am too oldscool.

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